Thursday, May 04, 2006

Yes it's long, but read it anyway

Our apologies in advance to the commenter who pleaded for shorter posts. Our fingers have been worn to stubs these past few days, but such is the puffing of smoke and flashing of mirrors emanating from Guyton Street as the LTCCP comment process heads into the final straight that some depth of analysis is called for. A number of commenters have disputed our attitude toward Council borrowing and spending (particularly on the Splash Centre). We can't answer them all point-by-point as it'd take more words than anyone would be prepared to read.

But most have a similar refrain, and someone calling him (or her) self "an ordinary plod" made a comment in response to the last post which seems to pretty much cover most it, so we'll respond to that point-by-point.


Like most of your analyses LawsWatch - this latest effort is flawed on a number of levels. I note that you don't publish postings about your stuff-ups but here goes anyway. All the below info is from publicly available sources either council agendas or minutes or Chronicle reports.
And of course everything published on the Council website (direct from Mickey's spin) and in the Chron (re-hashes of Spin Fairy press releases) is beyond reproach. We don't claim to be perfect, just more accurate than that litany of obfuscation. Mr/s Plod continues:


The new Splash Centre will have no additional operational expenses for ratepayers so Palmer is wrong. If he uses that logic then no wonder he was turfed off council in '04.
Let's start by defining the size of the problem. Keith Hindson reported to Council on Monday 12 September 2005 that operating costs would increase by between $300,000 and $525,000 (at 2004/05 prices) in addition to the Centre's current funding of $342,000 per annum.

Then, at the Community Committee meeting on 7 December 2005 Denis McGowan, Danny Jonas and Eric Sim informed councillors that "overall operating cost if the proposed development proceeded would be 147% of the current cost, leading to a projected community facility’s charge for each ratepayer under Swimming Pools of $57.25". In other words, a rates increase.

Then at the Strategy Committee meeting on 15 December 2005 received a further report which informed them that:


The current cost to the Council for the Splash Centre is $334,000 per annum. This includes the management contract, repairs and maintenance, associated property costs and interest payments etc. The forecast cost to the Council to operate the original pool and new extension in today’s dollars is $825,000. This includes $100,000 of interest repayments on the $1,500,000 capital funding identified in the Long-term Council Community Plan (LTCCP), a doubling of the property and maintenance costs as the facility will double in size. The management contract would rise from the current $243,000 to $556,000... An allowance has been included in the LTCCP for increases in operational expenditure in 2006/07, however there is still a shortfall of $329,000 which needs to be addressed.
So will people such as Mr/s "Ordinary Plod" flock to the Splash Centre in sufficient numbers to make up this shortfall? Council's own report doesn't know, and predicts the possibility of increased entry charges:


The projected increase in patronage is 50%. However, Sport and Recreation Wanganui are targeting a 100% to 120% increase in patronage as new markets become available. It must be noted that these forecasts are based on the existing entry fees. Increases in entry charges have not been considered at this stage, but it is a decision the Council may need to consider in the future as means of reducing the Council contribution towards the operational cost of the facility.
Let's pause to recap, to help those who are daunted by long posts such as this:


  1. Operating costs will rise from the current $334,000 per year to $825,000.
  2. Council reports project the imposition of an additional community facility charge for each ratepayer of $57.25.
  3. A further report predicts the possibility of increased user charges.
"No additional operational expenses for ratepayers", Mr/s Plod? Perhaps, perhaps not. Indeed the Diva seems to support your assertion, despite Council officers' professional advice to the contrary. According to a response on 29 April 2005 from Ian McGowan to a Watcher's enquiry :


Mayor Michael Laws says... additional operating expenses of the two major projects (i.e. the Sarjeant Gallery and Splash Centre Extensions) would need to be borne by the organisations responsible for running the facilities and not by the Council. Council's contribution is the capital funding and proponents of some projects may need to cut their cloth as a consequence.
But the Splash Centre isn't cutting it's cloth (or rather it's water slides). It's going with the full blown all-the-bells-and-whistles plan. And if there isn't going to be a $57.25 additional community facility charge once the new Centre is operational, then that will also have to be found by the Splash Centre.

So maybe ratepayers won't pay for it as ratepayers; instead they'll pay for it as swimmers. That makes all the difference. Unless they're detered by the increased user charges and stay away in droves, causing the Splash Centre to turn to Council...

Of course no one has actually made a decision on this, but we'll move forward anyway, and hope all is well. Yep, there's some fine fiscal rectitude for you.

And talking of decisions, let's move on to part 2 of Mr/s Plod's rebuttal:


If you're going to convert one asset to another (land into Splash extension) you haven't sold it but converted it from a land asset to a community asset. You could use that money to repay debt but then you'd build no new community amenities ever until all your debt was repaid and Wangas would stand still. I was one who voted in the referendum for Splash and I'm delighted it will be built and available to my kids as are most of my mates and neighbours. You obviously don't have kids or swim.
We do both, actually - well some of us do, and others do one or the other. But that's not the point.

First point: people weren't given the choice between debt repayment and the Splash Centre, because they were never asked whether debt repayment was a priority. The referendum was like offering a mordibly obese person a choice between cake and pavlova, not cake and a diet.

Second point: Asset sales equivalent to the cost of the project chosen in the referendum were meant to have been realised before the project proceeded. Our authority for that? None other than Michael Laws:


Mayor Laws... said that funding of referendum items would be based on the conversion of old Council assets to the new Council assets, therefore, for a referendum project to proceed the Council must first sell an asset to gain the funding required. (WDC Minutes 26 April 2005)
Third point: The people of Wanganui were meant to have been specifically consulted on asset sales before they occurred:


6. Asset Sales - Vision’s democracy policy ensures that the Wanganui public has the final say – by referendum – on all "issues of significance". That includes asset sales. No assets will be sold by the council without the prior consent of the Wanganui people.
Perhaps we missed that consultation? In case you're not even sure what these assets are, LawsWatch revealed in November 2005 that:


There are 48 properties listed for sale, across three portfolios and divestment funds may only be used as follows:
  • City Freehold: pay off debt or reinvest in assets or services offering greater amenity value to the District.
  • City Endowment Fund: all capital (divestment proceeds) must remain within the City Endowment and net income can be 'dividended' to Council or reinvested.
  • Harbour Endowment; all capital (divestment proceeds) must remain within the Harbour Endowment. Net rental income is payable (effectively a negative rent) to River City Port Ltd under the terms of the company's lease from Council (as administrator of the Harbour Endowment) to be used for port operations.
So let's see if we can summarise what's wrong with the process:


  1. The complete figures (which we've presented here over past months) ought to have been put in front of people in the referendum. Those figures, of course, would have included:
    • Rising construction costs
    • Increased debt servicing costs
    • Increased operating costs
    • The possibility of an increased community facility charge.
    • The possibility of increased user charges.
  2. The option of debt repayment should have been offered as a referendum choice, with the benefits clearly enunciated.
  3. If it was intended that the Splash centre be funded from asset sales, the specifics of such sales should have been put to that referendum or a prior one, in order to meet Vision's own policy pledge.
  4. Assuming permission was granted by the people of Wanganui to sell specific assets, the value of those assets should have been realised before work commenced on the Splash Centre - after all, this is what the Diva pledged just over a year ago.
We're not picking on you, Mr/s Plod - in fact your contribution is well thought out and diverse views are always welcome. But your reliance on Mayoral spin and Chronicle "reportage" means you - along with most of the rest of Wanganui - aren't getting the true picture, and you're contributing to Mickey's disinformation campaign by spreading it.

Comments on this post are now closed.

32 comments:

Anonymous said...

Mr/Mrs Plod here:

No, its YOUR spin that's out of control, LawsWatch! You keep quoting reports that are out of date (like Hindsons guesttimate) when the council has obviously received further updates on the operational expenses side. ALL the councillors voted unanimously for Splash to proceed, and none have challenged the mayor's comments on operating expenses. I attended the Splash council meeting and it was the chief executive who reiterated the point on op expenses being met by sponsorship, increased patronage (Hindson report assumed static patronage), splitting out the commercial operations (gym, cafe, hydroslides0 & increased user charges (from $2 to $3 was mentioned).
Second, no-one is objecting (except you) to the assets being converted. Laws made it plain (and now I've read the Vision policy) that he was referring to strategic assets (eg Wang Gas) not bits of spare land dotted over everywhere. You've misquoted him or been selective.
I will defend the mayor in this forum because what he is doing is what we - the real people of Wanganui - want. But the least you could do is get your facts right instead of all this misleading & selective quoting you're doing. I mean, did you go to that last Council meeting on the Splash Centre???

Laws Watch said...

ALL the councillors voted unanimously for Splash to proceed, and none have challenged the mayor's comments on operating expenses.

That doesn't make them right.

Laws made it plain (and now I've read the Vision policy) that he was referring to strategic assets (eg Wang Gas) not bits of spare land dotted over everywhere. You've misquoted him or been selective.

We've copied directly from Vision policy. Where does it say "strategic"? It says just the opposite: "No assets will be sold...", a quite uneqivocal promise. Whether he was wise to make it is debateable, but make it he did. Who decides what's "strategic" anyway?

I will defend the mayor in this forum because what he is doing is what we - the real people of Wanganui - want.

Given the "real people" were neither presented with the full facts nor given the option of debt reduction instead of spending, you cannot make that statement with any certainty. And that's our point. Perhaps people would have rejected debt repayment in favour of a pool with higher user charges and maybe an increased community facility payment, or maybe not, if more people go, if they can hock off the cafe operation, if next year is a good summer, if... but they were never given the facts or the opportunity to make a properly considered decision. And no amount of revisionist history rewriting can alter that fact.

Anonymous said...

Jingle bells, Michael smells,
A rat round ev'ry bend,
Sell the lot then bleat a lot,
And spend spend spend spend spend,
If the sums don't stack up,
Spin 'til your ears bleed,
Then manipulate the populace,
With denials fear and greed.

Telling porkie pies,
Makes everything alright
And when it's time to pay for it
We'll see he's not that bright.

TTROTAPLOL

Anonymous said...

We should do a musical at the next WDC Xmas party. There's enough songs in the LW archives for at least three acts.

We'd all have to wear masks but ;)

Anonymous said...

increased patronage, Mrs. Plod?
___________________________________

how much required before break even point in your very well endowed estimate?


"what we - the real people of Wanganui - want"

well, Mrs. Plod, I'm a real person, and I live here, so what the funt does this mean? On the one hand you claim to be an informed light in the Lawswatch cellar, but then you come out with trailer-park rhetoric like that?

Go find a communist country to live in if you're that sort of dinosaur, otherwise, you'd better learn that diversity is good for a community. And that includes diversity of opinion. You can't claim that the mayor has Whanganui's best interests at heart after the damage he's done.

Anonymous said...

excellent report on warren ruscoe`s newsletter today-we the wanganuiites are really what makes wanganui grow well
and as another `real person`(open to argument,michael?)i don`t approve of repertory theatre being sold for the splash centre`s benefit-i see BOTH as of equal value to this community
joan street

Anonymous said...

Mr/Mrs Plod here again:

Whoever reproached me for suggesting that they live elsewhere is probably right but the ad hominen attacks in here set a tone that infected me. It won't happen again.
Yes, ALL the councillors did vote for it does make it right. When personalities as divergent as Barbara Bullock and Mr Laws, Sue Westwood and Dot McKinnon, Randhir Dahya and Rangi Wills vote for something like the Splash Extension then I'll trust the collective wisdom of 13 elected officials versus the clear bias represented here.
Laws Watch - you didn't answer my Q. Were you there? because all the points you raise were either covered in the information presented or the CEO's address. No additional rates money to be spent on op expenses and it was Sue Westwood who welcomed that and spoke on it.

Anonymous said...

Who believes this mayoral bullshit. This pathetic excuse for a mayor has so discredited himself -- and LawsWatch at least sees this -- that his so-called assurances aren’t worth the three-ply they are written on. Whatever blackmail tactics he uses on the councillors don’t work with me or it seems the majority of Wanganui people.

“No additional rates money to be spent on op expenses” says Mickey Mayor who tries so hard to be anonymous. Does he really expect anyone here to believe a word he says? Not likely!

Bring back Antoinette Beck. Perhaps she could be the next spin fairy?

Anonymous said...

Vision's election policy 2004

"6. Asset Sales
Vision’s democracy policy ensures that the Wanganui public has the final say – by referendum – on all “issues of significance”. That includes asset sales. No assets will be sold by the council without the prior consent of the Wanganui people"

I agree with Ms Plod. It links issues of significance with asset sales and the council has a list of significant assets. They include the Art Gallery, Wanganui Gas and the forests but they don't include bits of land and property.
Laws didn't mislead. Laws Watch did.

Anonymous said...

So Joan Street is in here whining on like she does. Joan, unless I read my draft LTCCP wrong (and I don't) the council isn't saying they're going to SELL Repertory. They're going to give it to you and the other three superannuitants there. Look up divest in the dictionary, dearie.

Anonymous said...

It seems LawsWatch is not alone in the blogosphere.

A friend who is amazed at how much time and energy Mickey puts into anonymously defending his stupidity on this blog said to check out David Farrah’s Kiwi Blog. That’s where our mayor routinely gets slagged off by a fellow right wing ranter but no one -- not Mickey, not Bob, not John B, not even the mayoress rises to the bait. I found myself warming to Mr Farrah, despite his uncanny physical and ideological resemblance to Mickey’s other big fan NigelWho Morris Dancer.

Here’s what Mr Farrah (a fellow former snout-in-the-trough Wellington spin merchant) has to say. It seems even Mickey's fellow right wingers are embarrassed about our mayor's brand of local government fascism:

Michael Laws (whom one must acknowledge as an expert in this area) writes in the SST that: An element of sleaze has started to surround this administration

In a return to traditional idiotic popularism Michael Laws has proposed levying corporate fast-food outlets

In a return to traditional idiotic popularism Michael Laws has proposed levying corporate fast-food outlets

It looks like Michael Laws will easily win the Wanganui Mayoralty … Well I always say you get the politicians you deserve, and if anywhere deserves Michael Laws as Mayor, it would be Wanganui.


… described as a Game of Two Halves meets current affairs, will see Hosking head one team and radio broadcaster Michael Laws the other.

Sounds more like Michael Lover and Michael Liar

What has been very amusing is how Michael has tried to paint his resignation from Parliament in 1996 as a principled decision, rather than because he got caught out telling big porkies.

Drove to Wanganui on Saturday. Normally not a place I would visit (especially with the possibility of Mayor Michael Laws there)

Anonymous said...

“No additional rates money to be spent on op expenses” says Mickey Mayor who tries so hard to be anonymous. Does he really expect anyone here to believe a word he says? Not likely!
*****************************

Its this kind of paranoia that discredits this blog. I'm not the mayor but I willingly confess to posting the above comment about op expenses. Answer my questions, toad.

Anonymous said...

How come all the posters in here rage on but don't stand for council? Isn't that the place to test things? Im not shitting you but only a few people read this and wouldnt it be better to take your messages to the media or test them politrically?

Anonymous said...

joan street says `crap`-you read the plan and see that it offers 3 alternatives!
and as for superannuitants-carla donson?????etc
i`ll have you know that 1000 people saw `little voice` our last play
and don`t call me `dearie` again-it only ponts out who you are

Anonymous said...

Laws didn't mislead? He doesn't know how to do anything else.

So where did the Vision lies point out that "significant" would be defined accoding to Council's "significance" policy, as opposed to what the community might consider significant? Ommision is the same as lying. The whole document is a prime example of political cynicism.

"Vision will support and encourage the arts," for example. Mrs. Plod sounds more and more like a duplicitous clown. Much like the "mayor" in fact.

Anonymous said...

So the Council UNANIMOUSLY changed its mind, and decided to build the Splash Extension now instead of waiting. So what?? Apart from the arties squealing, who else gives a damn except to say good on the council for moving quickly. Thats what I like about this lot whether its Splash, the footpaths, Upok jetty, riverfront development they move bloody quick.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
So Joan Street is in here whining on like she does. Joan, unless I read my draft LTCCP wrong (and I don't) the council isn't saying they're going to SELL Repertory. They're going to give it to you and the other three superannuitants there. Look up divest in the dictionary, dearie.
___________________________________

What a load of disingenuous crap this is, mixed in with gratuitous (and inaccurate)insults. This effluent can only be the yellow putrescence of Michael Laws.

So repertory gets "divested" which means that Council gets to wash its hands of the maintenance and upkeep of a community asset, while bailing out a swimming pool (but not the one in Wanganui East which most people use). Mickey pretends that the Splash Centre will make money, which assertion has been demolished by Russ Hay in today's Chron. Council officers are contradicting his statements, which indicates that there is no discernable solid material in what he says.

In other words, you've been caught out lying, Mickey. Again. A competent mayor wouldn't have to lie so much.

Anonymous said...

Field of Dreams: Build it & they will come.
Don't build it and throw all the money at artists instead. who will piss it up against a wall.

Anonymous said...

"anonymous" said:

So Joan Street is in here whining on like she does.

*******************

So Mickey Mayor is in here being a tosser again, like he does.

Anonymous said...

Go Russ Hay (whoever you are) .. great letter in the paper today.

Not a good week for the mayor, though. Poor old Mickey's had to resort to penning his own "defence" and even worse, he had to scrape the bottom of the barrel and pull Bob Walker out from under his rock.

So much for the Mickey Defence League. Oh not forgetting Ms Brookhammer who must be just about due for another ghost-written chorus of Stand by my Man.

Anonymous said...

Gee, the mayor’s in the Chron sports section today saying he’s ‘gonna have to play a senior role in the reorganisation of sport and recreation in Wanganui.’ Whoo hooo! Mickey rides to the rescue again! Is that the same sort of leading role that you’ve been playing in the library “friends” fundraising and the swimming pool fundraising? Or perhaps you mean your skills in marketing et al which you demurely agreed were essential to the success of Wanganui Inc.

Funny how no one in this town seems to want a bar of Winc (except the Nigel Morrises and Ron Janes who have their snouts in the trough of directors’ fees). Even the new sport and rec committee headed by your pet rower seems to smell a rat with the plan to toss the Masters’ Games funding to Winc.

Anonymous said...

The mayor seems to be skating on thin ice with this splash centre farce hee hee.

Looks like super scoop Debbie and the RCP crew might have let the cat out of the bag and Mickey's Big Fat Secret Plan is really an ice-rink. Pity the spin fairy's not around to give them a good telling off.

Anonymous said...

Mrs. Plod said:

"the council has obviously received further updates on the operational expenses side."
___________________________________

Oh, "obviously" they have, have they? But they're not allowed to talk about it "for reasons of Michael Laws' incompetence" (or whatever). So where's your information coming from, Plod? What's your real name? Has someone been talking out of school or are you in fact doing that right here? I wonder how other Councillors feel about the contempt for them implicit in your statements, "Plod".

Does this breach Council confidentiality in the same way that the ice-rink story in the Midweek seems to have?

Oh and while your at it, answer Russ Hays' question: "Is there a public pool in NZ that makes its own way financially?"

Come on, "Plod". Let's face it, if you believe the stuff that comes out of Michael's mouth you must have shit for brains.

Laws Watch said...

Anon @ 2.00 pm - It's odd we find ourselves defending a critic, but "Plod's" comments seem, to our finely tuned ears, far too rational to be from or by the Mayor (albeit based on a misinterpretation of facts and a willingness to accept Mayoral spin). Maybe we're wrong.

But say whatever else you may, "Plod" hasn't played the man (or woman) as some commenters all too frequently do, at least not when identifying themselves as "Plod".

We've published your comment because the other points you make are very valid. But please, there's much light being shed on the debate for a change - let's not turn up the heat with insults. We'll leave that to Mickey's minions.

Laws Watch said...

Field of Dreams: Build it & they will come.
Don't build it and throw all the money at artists instead. who will piss it up against a wall.


We've never suggested throwing it at anyone other than Wanganui's many creditors. To further your analogy, yes, let's build a baseball field when we haven't paid off our trailer and the bank is about to repossess it and tow it out of the park.

Laws Watch said...

Thats what I like about this lot whether its Splash, the footpaths, Upok jetty, riverfront development they move bloody quick.

So go for speed and never mind effectiveness? Your wife / partner is no doubt very fortunate :-D

Anonymous said...

Ok I'll cool it on the contents of Michael's mouth. Everyone knows what it smells like and I'm having fun making up metaphors anyway.

Speaking of which, Didn't our favourite anonymous say he'd found someone to replace Helen? I heard she's not going to go the Council in the employment court today. She thinks it will damage her credibility, apparently, and my informant tells me she's worried everything will come out. I told him to get his mind out of the gutter. He laughed.

Anonymous said...

"throw all the money at artists instead. who will piss it up against a wall."
__________________________________

Your hatred of artists sounds very much like that of the "mayor's", which is to say demonstrative of a meanness of spirit that renders him unfit for office. Add to that the fact that creativity is the powerhouse of any higher-waged economy, and you start to sound really stupid. Add to that the fact that 77% of nz'ers agree that the arts contribute to the economy, and you start to sound stupid and irrelevant.

Care to comment, or are you still busy looking up 'demonstrative'?

Anonymous said...

Mr/Ms Plod here - thank you for that LawsWatch but the rest of the foulmouths in here worry me.
IF (and it's a big if) the matyor is not telling the truth regards Slash (and I believe he is) then why would ALL of the Council vote for this project and accept both his and the CE's assurances? You don't seriously expect me to believe that the Bullocks and Westwoods sign up to anything Mr Laws suggests unless it is a) rational b) popular c) nailed down.
I'm a confessed vision supporter because I've seen the difference they've made and I like the way they decide on something and then go and do it. Someone mentioned the Upok jetty - a good example.
But may I complain of a narrowness and meanness in here that is not justified. Mr Laws won democratically and he won with a team and a clear set of priorities. The worst mistake that the arts lobby did was get personal over the Sarjeant because he and his team are the ONLY ones who can make things happen. He doesn't seem to oppose you, he just ignores you and that seems to set off the tantrums in here which is like (if you'll excuse me) urinating against the wind. The arts haven't moved because they demand rather than persuade.
Letters to the Editor? I remember the 2004 and 2006 elections and they made no difference to the outcome. A friend told me that he reads the name and if its a certain couple of people he skips over it. Remember John Lithgow? Some people should remember that his letters never had any effect whatsoever.

Anonymous said...

It doesn't matter what anyone here thinks. Most of Wanganui accept the council's decisions and move on.

Anonymous said...

He doesn't seem to oppose you, he just ignores you
_________________________________

Are we on the same planet? He ignores what you call "the arts lobby", (which is just a collection of not-even-like-minded individuals), by writing letters in answer to their criticisms, by devoting front pages to abusing them, etc. etc.

What's really alarming is that the "mayor" seems to have let the actions of a few individuduals affect his entire approach to the arts sector in Wanganui, in defiance of his election promises, and apparently according to principles of narrow mindedness that he himself delights in writing about. Since you seem to think this betrayal of Wanganui is justified, perhaps you wouldn't mind explaining it for those of use who don't understand.

Bet you can't.

Anonymous said...

Lawswatch. Comments like: "Ok I'll cool it on the contents of Michael's mouth. Everyone knows what it smells like " and "she's worried everything will come out. I told him to get his mind out of the gutter. He laughed."

Shows that we have impressionable children visiting this blog. Perhaps you could be a little more vigilant in moderating some of the content in light of this?
Thank you.