A local yoof speaks...
Over on the Council Watch website, in comments on our Report Card on Sue Pepperell, none other than Morgs Hunter-Bell provides a wealth of useful information on youth initiatives in Wanganui. Since comments seem to be used by a few over-excited onanists to abuse their victim-du-jour (thus ensuring many visitors can no longer be bothered reading them at all) it's worth repeating here:In February, the word was put out to the community through a number of outlets that the council was interested in hearing youth opinions on all issues, including the possibility of a youth council.
Morgs (who claims "very little interest in pursuing politics as a career") also says "I'll be more than happy to provide this site with comprehensive information regarding both the "Youth Committee" and WYC'D (Whanganui Youth CollecteD)" so feel free to use the comments to ask...
Over the first month, approximately 80 young Whanganui-ites came along and discussed matters. Eventually as the group solidated (sic) into a more regular collection of committed attendees, we decided that we were open to the idea of establishing a youth council as well as doing our own things as a separate entity.
So first off, the youth that had any interest to begin with DID decide that a Youth Council could be something worthwhile. BUT this is not directly opposing skate parks, make out spots, etc. Much the opposite in fact. Just in the Skate parks area we have a high-profile member of the Wanganui Skate Trust, and a worker at Cheepskates among our attendance.
Here's what we've been trying to make clear for some time (often at the Community Committee table):
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62 comments:
Morgs is not a politician & he probably doesn't want to be. But he and his group have impressed everyone at council with their sincerity, ideas and ability to argue their own case. That praise is universal from what I've observed - from the mayor to Sue P to the older councillors.
Interesting that it was the dreaded Diva who actually had the youth council idea and lobbied during the annual process for the youth budget of $50K.
$54K. Don't like to be picky.
The $54,000 they stole from the Sarjeant.
Don't be silly. They didn't steel it, the Diva just wanted to cut the budget for the nil rates. The art community will know that.
Listen you miserable bunch of cretins, I've had enough of this constant whining and general bollocks. Please crawl back into the cave of malcontent you came from.
He has a support group? :-O
heck its Matt and Carol...
Hi Steve. Would you teach me to crawl please? I understand it's your forté.
The cretins ... or Steve?
Seriously folks, let's lighten up in here. Lose the attitude, LawsWatch - you're losing those of us who do care about this city & are prepared to rationally debate civic issues.
Your view of the Mayor is a bot OTT - sure, he'll stuff up now & then but it's a shit job at a shit time. Try getting Wanganui out of this current poo with that council. He'll be a miracle man if he can pull it off.
Morgs is too PC> Just get in there son, roll up your sleeves and do it. Stop angsting - it reads like chick-lit at the moment.
He'll pull it off if he can't keep his hands off it.
Wanganui has assets. Laws is a liability.
...let's lighten up in here... Lose the attitude, LawsWatch
Much of what we write is satire... i.e. a humorous view of the truth as we see it. The last thing we want LawsWatch to become is a gripe-fest. That's why we endeavour to have people propose solutions (e.g. the current DIY Referendum poll) and was our original criticism of the SOS and CoC people.
As Laws himself said, when welcoming this site in the Chron... it has a sense of humour.
Morgs is a baby - so PC it is sickening.
Laws is good for Wanganui - poor shite, I wish him good luck but he is against it.
Helen is gorgeous - give her a break.
Get a grip, Lawswatch - keep it up, so to speak.
Whoever anon is - mate, you're talking shit. This place is knee deep in crap. The rates are seriously high (40% on what I was paying in Hamilton & I got a free rubbish service)and your finances are totally fucked. I really dont think you understand how much trouble Wanganui is in and its nothing to do with Laws. I would hate his job and I see that none of you actually bothered standing to sort it out.
We still have high rates - they always were high, but they're not increasing and now everyone in NZ knows where we are and who our Mayor is - give the guy a break - give him at least 3 years before you judge - everyone in NZ knows where Wanganui is since he was elected.
For all the wrong reasons.
Morgs - it's me - the guy who told you to lay off the chick-lit.
Call me Jonah, after my hero.
Jonah says:
Forget stuffing around the edges. Youth in Wanganui are bored shitless and you seem to have a mayor who appreciates that. And I don't care where he got the money from but its obvious that you've got some serious pull at council.
So ... get us a Youth Council. Now. There's a trial coming up of 4 bored kids who went stupid one weekend and knifed an innocent kid to death. a youth council wouldnt have necessarily prevented that but a youth centre here, an under-18s nightclub and just some entertainment might have made the difference. You get rat-faced because what else is there to do?
So hop to it.
I hate to admit this but last weekend I went up to Auckland and had a lovely time with family and old school friends. We've never talked about Wanganui before except as in 'poor old T for living there - what a dump'. Well, they didn't talk about the river or Moutoa Gardens or the mayor with the toupee this time. They seemed positively entertained by our new mayor's style. Told me they wish they had a mayor with some vim instead of their George Wood. As I said, I hate to say it but he has put Wanganui on the map. And not badly.
Yeah, well we all have gotten rat-faced in our time - but don't excuse those shites with knives - no excuse, they are low-lifes - ask the victim's parents. Don't blame that on boredom, man - that's crap.
Jonah says:
Not excusing the shits. Don't get me wrong, Jeremy Frew was a decent kid and his Dad will grieve for him forever. And his mum too.
What I was saying is that there are a lot of kids out there who get into trouble on Fri & Sat nights and no-one gives a shit. The Devil makes work for idle hands (and minds). Look at this blog:)
You heard it here first:
Cr Ray Stevens was mistakenly sent an e-mail intended only for Vision councillors from the mayor. He's leaked it to the media.
The only unfortunate thing, I've been told, is that it doesn't say anything. But Ray forget about any sister city freebies, ay?
always been a bit of a maverick has our Ray.
Cr Ray Stevens was mistakenly sent an e-mail intended only for Vision councillors... I've been told... it doesn't say anything.
Oh, so it's entitled, "Our achievements to date" is it? ;-)
The issue, as usual, is way beyond you fools. The very fact that the Vision team meet beyond our ken is cause for alarm. Policy discussion should be confined to the council table. The Vision set-up enables them to have their "debate" outside, away from Council. They turn up to the table with their party line, treating the democratic process with contempt as they do so. There's no law against it so it can't be wrong, right?
They're a party and were elected as such. Only a simpleton would think they shouldn't caucus. But then there are plenty of simpletons out there. It called politics, people. Get real.
There were actually 3 parties at the last election. Vision, Ratepayers Assn and the Greens (John Milnes lot).
They're a party and were elected as such
Party politics has no (zero, nada, zip) place in local body politics. It's not illegal so it must be right, right?
Why should policy discussion be confined to the council table? I'd like to think all 13 of the mob I pay for, talk & Debate policy all the time. Even in their sleep, otherwise I'm not getting my money's worth. What do you reckon Ray's real beef is then? Does he secretly want to be a Vision coubncillor?
40,000 people. 12 representatives. Oh, sure there's room for political parties in the way. What could be wrong with that?
When policy has already been debated and decided at the Vision caucus, the Vision councillors turn up at the council table. Why would they need to listen to the arguments our other elected representatives bring? They already know how to vote. Am I the only person who understands what's wrong with that?
Morgan said:
"...would value even more comments on what young people are doing in wanganui and how to make them feel more a part of the community."
You sound like an old man, Morgan,
And your shirt is unbearably tight,
You've been putting on weight,
And lying in state,
And we feel you're in for a fright!
For while you negotiate with Council,
For years and for years and for years,
You hair will grow grey and your constituencay,
Will probably bore you to tears,
So let's face it Morgs Hunter old fellow,
Most teeny's would rather spend time,
In shafting the man,
Having sex in a van,
And getting there late, not on time.
TAPLOL
Stephens spits the dummy:
Michael Laws said:
"The result of last (Thursday) night was almost entirely social. That’s the other thing about these meetings; we enjoy each other’s company"
So, what were the bits that weren't entirely social, Michael? Or do we have to wait for the next council meeting and work that out for ourselves?
well now we know what Nicki Higgie meant when she said that the modern equivalent of a discussion is an email from the mayor.
Good morning!
I was quite excited last night when I read the comment here about the 'secret' e-mail. Then I read the Chronicle this morning & I'm going "is that it?!"
I would expect the Vision team members to get together to discuss everything, given that they were elected as a team. That's WHY they stood, isn't it. I'm only amazed that they meet so irregularly - every couple of months or whatever.
Has no-one told old Ray that there was an election last year? Actually it's nice to know he's still alive because when I made my submission to the annual plan, I was told he hadn't attended any of the meetings.
I guess the vision lot will tell Ray what they talk about when he tells them how many people he slags off at his petrol pump.
Yeah, I can't quite work out what the issue is either. It's pretty obvious that the vision and ratepayers people would vote for their election policies around the council table. The only reason we got that nil rates increase was because 8 of the 13 were committed from election day.
You get up awfully early for someone who can't work out the issue here.
Don't you just love the details of this meeting/non meeting dinner party/knees up. I bet Michael handed out the CV's, Bob and Leonie would have been miffed to be left out. Then I expect they all put their copies of the CV's into their briefcases which they all had with them right? They wouldn't have left them lying on the table, for example. So that's alright then, Leonie and Bob probably went for a walk 'round the block or something anyway.
Michael, would you please now tell us what the results of the votes at the next Council meeting will be? Or would that be like insider trading?
Insider trading? Not a bad metaphor for what Vision have been up to, eh?
Now, when at the next Council meeting, one of the other councillors comes up with a good argument, we know why Vision pays no attention to it. Still convinced there's nothing wrong here?
And what about the wine stains on Nicki's copy?
If it wasn't for vision plus Rangi Wills, this council would be in the boondocks. And since we're talking open democracy, wasnt Ray tevens one of those councillors who his the disastrous forestry receipts from the other councillors and the electorate last time round?
We should ask Ray. Has he received a copy of the CEO CVs? If he has, he should stop bleating.
Knees up Mother Laws,
Council's such a bore,
Why not make it much more fun,
Bring some drinks,
Invite your chums,
When you get to Council,
You'll all vote the same way,
Pissed up making policy,
Sounds like quite a game.
TAPLOL
Interesting thread because the minutes on the council website show me that Vision councillors vote on both sides of an issue. I suppose they stick together for their pre-election policy.
I admit to voting for them as a team because I wanted the changes they promoted. I expect them to work as a team to give me the policies I voted for. I'm pretty impressed with my $134 drop in rates, I can tell you.
That doesn't even rhyme!
If Michael Laws doesn't have the numbers for every council vote that he's promoting then he would be a fool. But he's not.
Compare with poor old Dick Hubbard in Auckland . Pulling his hair out (he has three strands left) because deputy Hucker white-ants him every week. Or Kerry Prendergast in Wellington who was lamenting in last month's Dominion-Post that she spends all her time assembling council majorities on minor isues that she has stuff all time for the big picture.
That is actually the GOOD thing about this council. The majority have a clear idea of what they're going to do. That's why things are getting done.
Please try and understand this: we employ councillors not just as dumb voting machines, but for their individual skills. There are 12 councillors because the multiple issues require that many hands on board to get a handle on all of it. By deciding policy direction without the benefit of all that experience and talent, Vision are selling Wanganui short. Look at the 'nil' rates increase, for example. If they'd discussed that openly, council officers might have been able to help them get it right the first time, instead of having to spend money on expensive lawyers.
So it's not just divisive and anti-democratic, it's inefficient and costs the ratepayer more.
They didn't spend any money on "expensive lawyers": it was the council officers who asked for a legal opinion according to my agenda. (Get them sent out every few weeks - you can request them from council. They're great).
Besides, what was Vision's #1 promise last year? Nil rates increase. Ditto Graeme Adam's ratepayers ticket - Action Wanganui. Did they deliver? No, damn them. They reduced my rates. I'll take that.
Is this the council experience that has driven Wanganui to the edge of bankrputcy? Give me the "inexperienced" Vision lot any day.
Have to disagree with the "we employ individuals" line.
It depends who you voted for.
I seem to remember that some people stood on party tickets when I voted. T
hey had their affiliation clearly marked on the ballot paper.
Some were "independent", others "Vision Wanganui", others "Action Wanganui" and others "New Energy".
Yu may have voted on their individual strengths/weaknesses but I voted for councillors with clear views and policies. So did most of Wanganui if you look at the election results.
Thats a fair analysis.
I chose not to vote for any Vision candidate at the last election - liked Dot but didnt vote for her because I didn't like her leader.
I had friends who voted all Vision because that would give them a majority around the council table to do the things they promised.
So we can't say, no matter which way we voted, that we were not aware that 'teams' were standing and 'teams' might be elected.
The other substansive issue is honesty. Laws has been caught out in a lie again: "I don't think in terms of Vision and non-Vision in this Council." Other Vision Councillors who have made similar statements (Nicki Higgie) have also lied.
Can we trust anything these people tell us? Probably not.
Like "the CEO's position will be the individual decision of every Councillor and by secret ballot". Right, so we just have to "trust council will do the right thing" eh?
Local Government Act 2002 (my emphasis:
39.Governance principles—
A local authority must act in accordance with the following principles in relation to its governance:
(a)a local authority should ensure that the role of democratic governance of the community, and the expected conduct of elected members, is clear and understood by elected members and the community; and
(b)a local authority should ensure that the governance structures and processes are effective, open, and transparent; and
(c)a local authority should ensure that, so far as is practicable, responsibility and processes for decision-making in relation to regulatory responsibilities is separated from responsibility and processes for decision-making for non-regulatory responsibilities; and
(d)a local authority should be a good employer; and
(e)a local authority should ensure that the relationship between elected members and management of the local authority is effective and understood.
Wouldn't surprise me if other sections apply. "Open and transparent?" We can't even join Vision to see how they do things. This is the very opposite of "Open Democracy", and as for transparency, forget it.
I don't think Vision will put up another candidate, it might be too risky if they lose.
"I don't think in terms of vision or non vision on this council" Nicki Higgie
I think the cron should investigate this story further in light of "the e-mail"
questions to other vision team members rather than ML
Come on Sean we know you read this, lets get a better picture of what's going on.
That's a good point. Higgie mentioned (bless her) that they use email discussion too. Is this another aspect of this secret government?
I hope there is secret government because I'd hate to think you plonkers had any influence!
You're being silly, people.
If Vision didn't operate as a team to achieve their objectives, they would be in clear contravention of their election promises.
According to their literature, they have 'party' positions on their policy and free votes on everything else. They put out a lot of policy before the election (incl an arts and heritage policy I see) and if they weren't referencing their progress against that, we'd been criticising them for breaking their promises!
Now we all know Ray and Ray gets the pip at everyone once in awhile. If you remember he was required to apologise to a council officer for questioning his integrity and being unable to prove his claims. Glasshouses, people.
I bet a cream doughnut that Vision will put up a candidate and resource them very well.
In what context did the mayor make his statement about vision and non-vision? As I remember my Chronicle it was about appopinting people to council committees wasn't it? If so, aren't non-vision councillors like McGregor & Dahya chairmen of committees? And Wills? And hasn't Pepperell been demoted to a deputy?
Just asking.
"...Glasshouses, people..."
What shite. I've been alarmed by the Vision hegemony since they first vomited up Michael's will and called it policy. So weird Ray just noticed, and that gives us a chance to debate the issue.
"In what context did the mayor make his statement about vision and non-vision? "
In the context of a deliberate lie.
"incl an arts and heritage policy "
which isn't worth shit. In fact the whole thing is a lie: they should have said: "we promise to destroy the SGTB in order to put the artists in their place."
But that's right, we're just being silly.
You should run for Council Morgs. Let's draft him!
If my little ditties offend you,
Remember this one thing I beg,
It's not poetry petal it's politics,
It's an election year don't you forget,
The biggest hazard to your health right now,
Is the politician humping your leg.
TAPLOL
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